It probably says a lot about my age in fandom...

[jedibuttercup]

... that when I'm surfing AO3 and see something like "(Y/N) Stark is the youngest daughter of Eddard and Catelyn Stark" in a fic summary, I immediately think "Yes/No" instead of "Your Name". It trips me up every time, and even after I remember, I have a hard time seeing the appeal. I did read some of those Choose Your Own Adventure books that were popular when I was a kid in the 80s; but even then, I had to sit down with a notebook and plot out which pages jumped where so I could figure out which was the most satisfying ending -- and most of them actually weren't. I read -- and write-- fic to explore the characters and/or world(s) I loved in canon, not to insert myself into it, especially not a reader-fic version of my self that will (because genericized) be by default OOC.

I know, I know. Different people want different things out of fic; a lot of people do prefer it as escapist wish-fulfillment. Or ... maybe it's just that online fandom wasn't a thing until after I was through my own Mary Sue phase, and the shape of that trope's changed a lot in the years since? For me, it was a bunch of short stories scribbled in erasable ballpoint pen in a spiral-bound notebook, telling stories about how I and my BFFs and my defected-from-the-enemy made-up boyfriend survived an apocalypse in my hometown, or got caught in a time-loop and had to save the world, or became sexy spies, or were born into a fantasy universe where different bloodlines had special magic powers, etc. I'm pretty sure those stories still exist, somewhere in a dusty box; I'm equally glad they'll never again see the light of day. Maybe I would have been one of those people writing up those kinds of fic-ified imagines to share with others, if wifi and smartphones and Tumblr were a thing when I was thirteen instead of dial-up slow-as-fuck AOL. :)

Anyway. You may have noticed I've made a resolution to blog more this year; I'm hoping more engagement will help keep me from sliding back into last year's blue fugue.

Along similar lines: I'll be signing up for this year's getyourwordsout - signups run through Jan 15, and their commitment levels start at 75,000 words. I'm not sure yet which level I'll sign up for, but their accountability posts should help keep me going. :)

Comments

[ffutures]

Really with you on that one - apart from anything else, it's a fairly good sign that the story will be unreadable.

[jedibuttercup]

I know; it doesn't even have the fig-leaf of an OC name, it's just very blatantly what it is. I guess for the people who do like that sort of thing, though, it does make it very easy to filter for!

[sulien]

Now that you mention it, I think I did see some LotR and Stargate based self insert fics over on AO3 and wondered WTF, then made sure to skip anything by those authors, Y/N tag or not. Just NO.

Forgive me for saying, but I have the feeling that your early Sue's would still be worlds better than the stuff getting published on paper these days, especially if you gave them a going over. I made the mistake of buying the All Souls trilogy because the author is a history professor at USC. The books are very well written and she's great with historical characters and details, but that's about the only thing that elevates them above Stephenie Meyers' Twilight books. X-p I swear, I have gotten spoiled rotten by the better fic authors out there, yourself included. :-/

[jedibuttercup]

Next time I find them, I guess I may have to finally give them a skim and post them friends-locked ... I've been meaning to go through my old boxes this year, they're starting to stack up since my mom finished emptying her attic.

[I am now the proud possessor of the baby shoes my pediatrician tied together to correct my extreme duck-footed tendencies as I slept; my report cards from grade school; the ornaments I made by hand for my parents' Christmas tree; the Houston Chronicle newspaper from the day I was born; and sundry other random memorabilia.]

[sulien]

Yay for family memorabilia. :) If you do post those early stories, please count me as the first in line to read them. I may not be overly interested in the spy thing (I only ever had a marginal interest in even James Bond), but the rest sound like things I would very much enjoy reading. And if you wind up publishing them, I'll buy copies of the first run! :-D

[grundyscribbling]

It's not just you. I read your first sentence and started to trying to figure out why Ned and Catelyn's youngest daughter was named Yes/No before I got to the "Your Name" part. *headdesk*

[jedibuttercup]

LOL. I guess the point is for people to copy it into a word processing program and search-replace the Y/N with their own name? *headscratching* Not my thing.

[ffutures]

I never thought of that - it's like those kiddie books where the character name is the same as the child it's printed for. Probably about the same level of plot complexity...

[tassosss]

I really like the habit pledges at getyourwordsout. It takes some of the pressure off the daily or monthly word count goals but because I’m sitting down to write more even the small days add up.

[jedibuttercup]

I see your point! But I think I want the word-count kick in the butt this year after how poorly I performed last year. And I certainly have a stack of prompts to clear out that would help me cross that finish line! I just need the motivation to stick to it.

[james]

Is THAT what Y/N stands for! I could never figure it out. (I knew it was self-insert, but couldn't figure out what it meant.)

[jedibuttercup]

I'm pretty sure it's meant to be a handy search-replace token, so you can copy it into a Word doc or something and stick your own name in there. Otherwise it's hardly a readable way to refer to a character!

[james]

I could only think it was referring to the reader could be he or she, but it never did quite parse correctly. M/F was somehow to the new generation a Y/N thing.

[jedibuttercup]

Trying to figure out what Y/N might stand for in that context is a little confusing. :) Now that I think about it, though, I don't think I've seen a single one of these that doesn't use she/her pronouns. I wonder if there are any guys out there writing in that style?

[edenfalling]

I've never quite understood the appeal of Character/Reader style insert fics. I mean, even if I do a search-and-replace on the (Y/N) thing to stick my own name in there, the insert character is clearly NOT going to be me. It won't even be an idealized version of me. So I'd be left either with someone so bland as to make me wonder what anyone sees in them, or that same sense of dissonance I always get when reading stories about somebody who shares my legal first name.

Maybe they personalize better if you're the kind of person who enjoys that kind of story? Since the writers are tailoring their inserts to be recognizable to that type of reader?

[jedibuttercup]

Yeah; especially the ones that are obviously written in second person. I skimmed one or two; it felt oddly as if the author had disassociated and was talking to themself, not that I was actually in the character's skin.

I would not be surprised if a lot of these readerfic come out of communities that are mostly writing to each other. But their id is not my id. :)

[elrhiarhodan]

I mean, even if I do a search-and-replace on the (Y/N) thing to stick my own name in there

I have no interest in the Reader Insert genre, but they are rather popular in my two most recent fandoms, so unless I wanted to heavily filter my AO3 experience, I would have to put up with at least one or two of them on every page. So I looked at a few, for curiosity's sake and very easily decided that it would be worth filtering these fics out.

One of the things I noticed (which brings me to my comment) is that so many of these fics had "warnings" - "DO NOT DOWNLOAD!!!!! DO NOT COPY INTO A WORD DOC!!!!! MUST READ ON INTERNET PLATFORM ONLY!!!!"

The writers of these stories absolutely do not want you the reader to actually put your name (Y/N) into the story. I don't know why, given that you are supposed to put your name (Y/N) into the story.

I will leave this conundrum for wiser minds to solve.

[edenfalling]

Oh, weird. That doesn't make any sense at all.

I've been filtering those fics out on AO3 for a couple years now -- I just type in -"/reader" in the additional filtering box every time I go to a new fandom page. It makes my life so much less frustrating.

[jedibuttercup]

Of course, then there's the fandoms that use /You instead. I was using the various filter checkboxes to drill down to a particular trope and fic length and then went into screen out pairings I didn't want, and there it was, in the top ten list. Who would even canonicize a tag like that, anyway? *sigh*

Also: just found the browser extension they probably mean you to use instead of icky manual search-and-replace that gasp, might result in you pirating some of their work. Change it once, and all Y/N ever will suddenly show up in your name on any webpage you view that includes it. (Which, LOL, would probably make any article you viewed that legitimately used Y/N for yes/no a rather interesting read ....)

[jedibuttercup]

Isn't there some kind of browser extension that'll do the same thing? That must be what they're talking about. Not that I'd ever think to do that first, Word is more my speed and how would they stop me anyway? But it sounds like someone is all up in arms about getting 'pirated' or something. *eyeroll*

[I wouldn't know how to find said extension, but I've seen at least one person talk about changing a certain president's name to always show up as, um, a rather unflattering epithet on any webpage they view, so.....]

[NM: found it, in case you're curious.]

[elrhiarhodan]

There is absolutely an extension for this - AO3 Saviour, but it's Chrome and Firefox, not for an IOS (or I guess Android) device. I actually have a bunch of authors and tags (including reader insert) that I don't want to see and I use the RSS code method to filter them out, then I have that saved to my Pinboard and load it on my phone and tablet as a bookmark.

[jedibuttercup]

Cool. I've never used any extensions, except for a couple of job related ones, so I'm a little at sea on what people use them for.

[rose_griffes]

Yes-No is my first internal translation when I see that, too. It took me a very long time to figure out what it actually meant. I've come across those stories mostly in Star Wars fandom, and that's a such a huge group that it's hard to say if this is trending upward, or if it's just the size of the fandom.

(Those those stories have zero appeal for me, but I was wondering if I could change that. Maybe: [Y/N] runs Kylo Ren through with a lightsaber. [Y/N] slips poison into Kylo Ren's coffee caf drink. [Y/N] looks on in grim satisfaction as Kylo Ren gets tried in front of an inter-galactic tribunal for war crimes, and is sentenced to life in prison.)

[sulien]

(Those those stories have zero appeal for me, but I was wondering if I could change that. Maybe: [Y/N] runs Kylo Ren through with a lightsaber. [Y/N] slips poison into Kylo Ren's coffee caf drink. [Y/N] looks on in grim satisfaction as Kylo Ren gets tried in front of an inter-galactic tribunal for war crimes, and is sentenced to life in prison.)

There really needs to be a like button on here, but since there isn't I'l just settle for saying right on!

[elrhiarhodan]

You read my mind. I was looking for a Like button, too.

[jedibuttercup]

LOL. The reaction to that would definitely be interesting to see!

It probably is in part a function of the size of the fandom - in that it's big enough to draw a significant number of that age/culture group of writer. The place I first ran across enough to start noticing them was actually King Arthur: Legend of the Sword fandom, though - you would not believe how many readers apparently want to have grown up in the brothel with that version of Arthur, or have been evil King Vortigern's abused daughter, or a mage kept captive by Vortigern, or .... :)

[pronker]

not to insert myself into it This, so much.

Thanks for clarifying the Y/N tag and hee, one Choose Your Own Adventure book had me flipping back and forth between p.24 and p.47 in a time loop trap. I blame Youngest for bringing the thing home from the library. On the other hand, Y/N could be considered just another format to write in, like Five Things That Character X Did And One Thing He Didn't ... *trails off, pondering ... *

Best of luck on Get Your Words Out!

EAD: Also like to read that you wrote in erasable ink, easier to read for Tenth Walker stories (or whatever you enjoyed at the time) and easy to edit, too. :)

[jedibuttercup]

It was neater than pencil, lasted longer, and yet didn't stop me from making corrections later ... that was definitely why I burned through so many erasable ballpoint pens. :)

I vaguely remember finding a CYOA like that that didn't have a 'real' ending, too ... those frustrated me so much! I skimmed all the jump-to's first without actually reading much of the text to make notes like this:

1 - 4 - 11 - 44 - 27 (or whatever, etc.)

and then once I had all the paths written down, went back and read all the different versions properly. The ones that didn't make a proper story seriously annoyed me!

[flingslass]

Y/N, same response. And Your Name just screams Mary Sue at me!